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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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 Stephen King's "It" (Locked) |
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| Author |
Message |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting m.cellophane: Quote:
Quoting m.cellophane:
Quote:
Will you be updating "Star Wars: no. 4, A new hope" and "The Phantom Menace." or shall I?
tick tock. Sorry to rain on your parade, but, since there is no possessive in this title, the only Rule that applies is "Use the title from the front cover". This Rule: "Include possessives if the front cover includes them, and if they are verifiably part of the title" which is the one that Skip is using to justify his use of the Copyright Office as the ONLY LEGAL source, cannot be applied to the Star Wars title. Sorry. We can only have LEGAL accuracy in the title when it has a possessive, unfortunately. For all others, we're stuck with the title on the front cover.  | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting hal9g: Quote:
Sorry to rain on your parade, but, since there is no possessive in this title, the only Rule that applies is "Use the title from the front cover".
Oh, you aren't raining on my parade, for sure. But I've had 'no' votes recently for not including these "accurate LEGAL titles" as the Original Title when I take the regular title from the front cover, possessive or no possessive.  Ah, found it. From my update of "The Thing": "Original Copyrighted title is JC's ,The Thing, use Original Title" | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan | | | | Last edited: by m.cellophane |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 13,201 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Unicus:
I have answered it, and i am not dodging it nor do i think you are being unclear. You don't like my answer. Um, not you haven't. I have gone back and looked. The only answer you have given is, "I disagree." You are correct, I do not like that answer because it isn't an answer. It is a deflection. It is an attempt to answer the question without actually answering it. That may work on some people, but it won't work on me. I am a parser and I see it for what it is. I guess it is possible that I missed your real answer. If I did, then I apolagize. Could you be so kind as to point it out to me? If I am being honest, I don't expect that you will because you haven't presented a logical argument...but I can hope.  Quote:
That said, you made at least one point for me. "Does the rule give us the accurate title as far as the DVD case is concerned? Maybe, maybe not." As I have said the ACCURACY issue was NOT brought up by me, it was brought to this issue by me. And I repeat, IF it is important that the SRP be accurate to the penny, despite what the Rules say, then certainly the single the single most important piece of data should be ABSOLUTELY ACCURATE as well, not... maybe, maybe not.
Skip Sorry, but this is a large red fish and you are giving it to the wrong person. As I said before, this may work on other people but it won't work on me. Why? Because I already agreed with you on the SRP issue.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | No one can copyright a title. The work itself is protected by copyright. Want to write a popular song, title is "Stardust"? Feel free. It is perfectly legal and within your rights to copyright said work. Would this infringe on the Hoagy Carmichael estate? No. Not unless you chose to copy his words or his music. But title? Not covered. Same with film, DVD, TV show, or anything else with a title. The title is of very little concern with the copyright office. Using the US Copyright website to determine the DVD Profiler title for a DVD is absurd. There is absolutely nothing in the submission rules that gives any permission to a contributor to use the Copyright Office's website to determine anything. To fully quote the rule: Quote:
Title
Use the title from the front cover.
Never add distinguishing factors to the title (such as "Widescreen" or "Special Edition"). Use the Edition field for these.
Check capitalization of the title.
Do not include quotes if they surround the entire title.
Include possessives if the front cover includes them, and if they are verifiably part of the title. If quotes surround the title in the credit block (generally on the back cover), check whether the possessive is within the quotes. In the absence of quotes to verify, check the font size used for the title on the front cover. Generally, possessives which use a significantly smaller font are not part of the title.
Possessive examples: "Tim Burton's Corpse Bride", John Carpenter's "The Thing". In each case, the portion within quotes is the title.
For English titles do not capitalize joining words such as "of", "the", "a", "in", etc. unless they are the first, last or only word in of the title. "Lord of the Rings" is correctly capitalized. "Lord Of The Rings" is not. "The Matrix Reloaded" is correctly capitalized. "The matrix reloaded" is not.
For non-English titles, use capitalization rules common to the language of the title “Tout va bien” is correctly capitalized. “Tout Va Bien” is not
If the title appears in multiple languages, use the title that matches the language of the locality and do not include an alternate title ( for instance in another language).
Episode descriptors are part of the title; separate them with a colon and space; e.g. "Star Trek III: The Search for Spock". For multiple descriptors, use a colon and space for each break, e.g. "Star Wars: Episode I: The Phantom Menace".
For music and stage performance DVDs, use the performer or group name followed by the DVD title, separated with a colon and space. For example: "U2: Rattle and Hum", "Ellen Degeneres: The Begining".
Annual DVDs such WWE or NFL Films titles if the year is included it is part of the title and should not be included in the Descriptor field. For Example Title: Year.
The title for a Box Set should be the title listed on the Front Cover; for example Alien Quadrilogy.
Where here is the Copyright website considered a reasonable source? Nowhere. The only sources listed are: 1) ... from the front cover 2) ... in the credit block (generally on the back cover) 3) ... on the front cover That's it. Use the front cover. If there is a possessive, try using the credit block on the back cover, or try the front cover (again) and look at the comparative font sizes. That's it. Nothing else. The accuracy is to be only to the cover of the DVD, not accuracy to a misleading list which may or may not be accurate from the US Copyright Office.  | | | If it wasn't for bad taste, I wouldn't have no taste at all.
Cliff |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 |  Posts: 2,692 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting VibroCount: Quote:
No one can copyright a title.
The work itself is protected by copyright.
Want to write a popular song, title is "Stardust"? Feel free. It is perfectly legal and within your rights to copyright said work. Would this infringe on the Hoagy Carmichael estate? No. Not unless you chose to copy his words or his music. But title? Not covered.
Same with film, DVD, TV show, or anything else with a title. The title is of very little concern with the copyright office.
Using the US Copyright website to determine the DVD Profiler title for a DVD is absurd. There is absolutely nothing in the submission rules that gives any permission to a contributor to use the Copyright Office's website to determine anything.
To fully quote the rule:
Quote:
Title
Use the title from the front cover.
I was just about to paste in a copy of the rules.. and you beat me to it. It seems clear from the rules that the intentiion is to have something which is straightforward for everybody to use - especially for those pesky non americans that make up that part of America that is overseas and who have DVDs which are not R1. Can anybody tell me if its standard for foreign DVDs to be included in the US copyright office? And if we were supposed to use this to check all dvd titles then why isn't the online site listed in the rules so we know how to find it? I could find it if I wanted to - but would a non English speaker be expected to search/locate his dvd title there? Somehow I think not. | | | | Paul |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 813 |
| | Posted: | | | | In Skipworld all films are made by Hollywood, and so have US copyright listings... the rest of (ie majority of) the film industry does not exist for him.
What a farce this conversation is... like so many recently. | | | Andy 
"Credited as" Names Database |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting pauls42: Quote:
Can anybody tell me if its standard for foreign DVDs to be included in the US copyright office? I was unable to find some of my non-US films in their database. I also just noticed this on their site: Quote:
Works registered prior to 1978 may be found only in the Copyright Public Records Reading Room. Maybe Skip can do our pre-1978 lookups since he lives near DC. | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Since you have enjoyed contributing to the farcical (or just perhaps it is satirical) nature, Lopek, you have little room to talk.
Some foreign films do carry US Copyrights, some don't.
Indeed I do live near DC and indeed I know where the copyright Office is, beyond that....
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 | | Posts: 445 |
| | Posted: | | | | Yikes!! Skip foiled once again...it seems to me a lot of films were made in the years prior to 1978.  Quoting Library of Congress Copyright Office: Quote:
The public may use the catalog, which is staffed by a Copyright Office employee, between 8:30 a.m. and 5:00 p.m. eastern time, Monday through Friday, except federal holidays. Since it's obvious to anyone who visits these forums that you have a lot of time on your hands Skip, perhaps you would be interested in a non-paying but highly rewarding position on a part-time basis. Perhaps you can visit the Copyright office let's say twice a week and you can sort out titles for the program. | | | | Last edited: by Bodi |
| | Registered: March 15, 2007 |  Posts: 131 |
| | Posted: | | | | The way I see it... It seem another debate on the fine line between profiling a movie and profiling a dvd.
In this case from the rules, we have to get the title from the DVD (front cover, back cover, credit block, etc.) NOT the movie.
So it has nothing to do with external sources that concerns the movie because another edition of the same movie might have a different front cover or a typo in the credit block and we'll have to reflect that in the profile. | | | | Last edited: by tarantino |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 810 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Paul:
Why is it so hard for you to understand ACCURACY, I did not raise the issue. but if the title field, arguably the most important single piece of data, does not have to be ACCURATE, then why does the SRP field have to be accurate despite the fact the Rule says DO NOT. Consistency...one way or the other.
Skip It is easy to understand ACCURACY. In this case it means that you get the title from the DVD case. The rules are very clear on this! pdf | | | Paul Francis
San Juan Capistrano, CA, USA |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | Paul and you have missed the point my friend, i suggest you study mis missives closer. Your use of ACCURACY is out of context.
Sklip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 6,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting tarantino: Quote:
The way I see it... It seem another debate on the fine line between profiling a movie and profiling a dvd.
In this case from the rules, we have to get the title from the DVD (front cover, back cover, credit block, etc.) NOT the movie.
So it has nothing to do with external sources that concerns the movie because another edition of the same movie might have a different front cover or a typo in the credit block and we'll have to reflect that in the profile. Please re-read the Rule. The Title is to come from the Front Cover only, except in the case of a possessive, in which case you can "verify" the title using te credit block on the back cover. The exceptions for foreign films and TV series, of course, remain in effect. | | | | Hal | | | | Last edited: by hal9g |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Paul and you have missed the point my friend, i suggest you study mis missives closer. Your use of ACCURACY is out of context.
Sklip "I was on acid and I looked at the trees and I realized that they all came to points, and the little branches came to points, and the houses came to point. I thought, 'Oh! Everything has a point, and if it doesn't, then there's a point to it.'" -- Harry Nilsson “A point in every direction is the same as no point at all.” "He's got a point!" | | | If it wasn't for bad taste, I wouldn't have no taste at all.
Cliff |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 4,596 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting skipnet50: Quote:
Sklip When did you change your name?  | | | | My WebGenDVD online Collection |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,635 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting 8ballMax: Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:Quote:
Sklip
When did you change your name? Skip slipped. (and created a portmanteau) | | | If it wasn't for bad taste, I wouldn't have no taste at all.
Cliff | | | | Last edited: by VibroCount |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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