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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Contributing to Profiles of DVD's you Don't Own |
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| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting oleops: Quote:
Please read what I say.
I said that in all my profiles he was credited all in capitals (not Visner or Vízner or anything else.)
I said "VIZNER and VÍZNER becomes Vízner and nothing else"
I am following the rules and have also tried to tell you this in my post here, its there to read.
I am not encuraging anyone to break the rules, I simply state that in some cases the rules can be followed and you can change profiles of DVD's you don't own without doing any damage and has given an example.
(and NO I am not saying that everybody can do what ever they feel like)
And at the end it was a profile that you also have lurked into that brougth up my attension to VISNER beeing Vízner and not Visner (Visner vould have folloved the US capitilazation rule)
And I have done a proper investigation to be shure myself, before I did the correction to all my other profiles (and NO I have not lurked into other profiles) But VISNER does not equal Vízner, it equals Visner...this is per Ken's post on this subject here. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | I believe he is talking about accents... but as Ken said on page 4 of the thread Unicus linked to... Quoting Ken Cole: Quote:
No, there are no special English rules to apply. Since "é" has a corresponding "É", simple capital conversion is all that's required. If the character used in the all-caps name is "É", convert it to "é" as needed to create mixed case. If the character used in all-caps is "E", convert it to "e" as needed to create mixed case. So we use straight upper case to lowercase... if there is an accent used in the credits so do we... but if there is not an accent used in the credits we do not. | | | | Pete | | | | Last edited: by Addicted2DVD |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Thanks Pete, seems I linked to the wrong post.  As to the OT, I do not believe you should contribute DVDs you do not have in your hand. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 14, 2007 | | Posts: 5,734 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Thanks Pete, seems I linked to the wrong post.
As to the OT, I do not believe you should contribute DVDs you do not have in your hand. Why not correct a wrong Production Year, Country of Origin or Theatrical Release Studio? What's the harm? Why not correct mistakes in an Overview you clearly see on the Back Image? Love, bbbbb | | | | Don't confuse while the film is playing with when the film is played. [Ken Cole, DVD Profiler Architect] |
| | Registered: March 19, 2007 |  Posts: 700 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
But VISNER does not equal Vízner, it equals Visner...this is per Ken's post on this subject here. What the F... do I have to be in here every day.. Gerri just wrote this two months erlier to that: ***** For clarification: Just as with titles, when having to alter cast or crew because they are listed in all capitals, use capitialization rules standard to the language of the cast/crew member's name or nationality. -Gerri ***** And I have search and red multiple pages of François this and that... Belive me I am gettin frustrated Ken MUST update the rules more often, or at least collect his clearifications (and discuss them with Gerri) SO what do I do I have just updated several of my profiles and contributed to get them linkable by changing Vizner to Vízner.  Only one of them has the VÍZNER credit.. Should I double back then and use the common name, witch by my own investigation would be wrong to follow as the CLT results then will change.. (se below) This is what I have contibuted: ***** Investigated the name for Jaroslav Vízner and the CLT tells us the following: Jaroslav Vízner 14 titles (108 Profiles) Jaroslav Vizner 10 titles (58 Profiles) Of the 10 titles from CLT for Vizner I only not own one title (Last Holiday). All those profiles is credited with Capital letters and one of those is with Czech Í - VÍZNER witch will translate into Vízner This makes a clear win for the Vízner with an í credit as this is how it is used in Czech language, so there is no need for the usage of common name. To further prove the use of Vízner with an í see the Czech movie database. http://www.csfd.cz/herec/36647-vizner-jaroslav/***** | | | | We are all at the same age, only at different time... |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting oleops: Quote:
What the F... do I have to be in here every day..
Gerri just wrote this two months erlier to that:
*****
For clarification:
Just as with titles, when having to alter cast or crew because they are listed in all capitals, use capitialization rules standard to the language of the cast/crew member's name or nationality.
-Gerri
*****
And I have search and red multiple pages of François this and that...
Belive me I am gettin frustrated
Ken MUST update the rules more often, or at least collect his clearifications (and discuss them with Gerri) I understand your frustration and agree that these clarifications need to be added to the rules or, at the very least, a FAQ. Quote:
SO what do I do I have just updated several of my profiles and contributed to get them linkable by changing Vizner to Vízner. Only one of them has the VÍZNER credit..
Should I double back then and use the common name, witch by my own investigation would be wrong to follow as the CLT results then will change.. (se below)
This is what I have contibuted:
*****
Investigated the name for Jaroslav Vízner and the CLT tells us the following:
Jaroslav Vízner 14 titles (108 Profiles)
Jaroslav Vizner 10 titles (58 Profiles)
Of the 10 titles from CLT for Vizner I only not own one title (Last Holiday).
All those profiles is credited with Capital letters and one of those is with Czech Í - VÍZNER witch will translate into Vízner
This makes a clear win for the Vízner with an í credit as this is how it is used in Czech language, so there is no need for the usage of common name.
To further prove the use of Vízner with an í see the Czech movie database.
http://www.csfd.cz/herec/36647-vizner-jaroslav/
***** Here is where you have misunderstood the rules. We are after the most credited form of the name, not the actual name. If the credit is VIZNER, then the name has to be entered as Vizner. If the most credited form of the name is Vizner, then you would have to use the credited as feature for the single instance of Vízner. Now, whether or not you go back and change them is up to you. If it were me, I would change them as they are wrong according to the rules and Ken's clarifications. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 17,334 |
| | Posted: | | | | Once again I agree with all that Unicus has said | | | | Pete |
| | Registered: March 19, 2007 | | Posts: 700 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Here is where you have misunderstood the rules. We are after the most credited form of the name, not the actual name. If the credit is VIZNER, then the name has to be entered as Vizner. If the most credited form of the name is Vizner, then you would have to use the credited as feature for the single instance of Vízner.
Now, whether or not you go back and change them is up to you. If it were me, I would change them as they are wrong according to the rules and Ken's clarifications. No I have not misunderstood the rules, I followed the clarification by Gerri and then the credit would have read Vízner and then there should not be need of an common name... Now the situation is different, with the profiles getting to be Vizner again, but... As stated all my profiles for this person is with capital letters this also goes for most of the titles using Vízner from before and I have only found one title with VÍZNER. So the CLT getting us wrong answer and when enough profiles is updatet (wich I presume is newer if we are not alowed to change them without owning the title (((hey back on topic there for a while)))) | | | | We are all at the same age, only at different time... |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  | | Posts: 3,480 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Addicted2DVD: Quote:
Gerri has posted about this before. She came out against it in general...
Quoting Gerri:
Quote:
In general we don't recommend submitting cast and crew for DVDs that you don't own because there can be discrepancies between localities, editions, and cuts (for example) and it can be difficult to validate without actually owning the DVD.
-Gerri
So I would take that as only update the actual DVD you own. I wish this were not the policy, but I stay within these boundaries. I wish that we could update a profile using any copy of that film, unless the contribution notes indicate that an as-credited update has already been performed from an owned DVD. If a non-owned update has been performed on a profile, this would not preclude someone from later doing an update from the actual UPC. If we did this, we could clean up the db much more quickly than we are now. I have done updates recently where the imdb name still outnumbers the credited name by a wide margin. This is 4 years after the beginning of 'as-credited' updates! How long to acheive 100% 'as-credited' updates and a clean CLT? I would think the answer is "decades" under the current policy. | | | ...James
"People fake a lot of human interactions, but I feel like I fake them all, and I fake them very well. That’s my burden, I guess." ~ Dexter Morgan |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,202 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting oleops: Quote:
No I have not misunderstood the rules, I followed the clarification by Gerri and then the credit would have read Vízner and then there should not be need of an common name...
Now the situation is different, with the profiles getting to be Vizner again, but...
As stated all my profiles for this person is with capital letters this also goes for most of the titles using Vízner from before and I have only found one title with VÍZNER. So the CLT getting us wrong answer and when enough profiles is updatet (wich I presume is newer if we are not alowed to change them without owning the title (((hey back on topic there for a while)))) Ah, I understand now. Sorry for the misunderstanding. It does get hard, and can get frustrating, when you don't visit on a regular basis and miss some of the clarifications. A FAQ, with some of these clarifications, would help quite a bit. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 19, 2007 | | Posts: 700 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Unicus69: Quote:
Ah, I understand now. Sorry for the misunderstanding. It does get hard, and can get frustrating, when you don't visit on a regular basis and miss some of the clarifications. A FAQ, with some of these clarifications, would help quite a bit. Well, started the process of changing it back again... I think I am in here quit often but some posts just grows out of propotions sometime and the arguing going on in some of them just prevents me from reading them all. And when Ken then states somthing at the end of the post it goes by me. (maybe a look into Kens posting from time to time could do the trick) Thanks for all the help to get be back on track again, but... my original post about this being an example of the need to change other profiles stands, as the situation for this still stands but now only the other way around and now it is only regarding profiles I don't own... (in the spesific Vizner case I am not going to use CLT results I know is wrong I simply don't contribute those changes) | | | | We are all at the same age, only at different time... |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | CLT results are based on what the ACTUAL credit says, not what you THINK it says.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | | Posts: 281 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting Dr Pavlov: Quote:
CLT results are based on what the ACTUAL credit says, not what you THINK it says.
Skip Yes that is what it is suppose to do but when profiles are contributed and are not by the actual end credits but are copied from a third party source then it throws off the CLT. If every profile was contributed by the actual end credits then the CLT would work perfectly, but we all know that there are profiles that have been excepted in the past that where not from the end credits. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | I know, Dragon. But IF all users were following the Rules and playing from the same page, and verifying that cloned data matched the ACTUAL, then we would be in far better shape. The problem si neither of those things is happening.
Skip | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video |
| | Registered: March 29, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 4,479 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting oleops: Quote:
No I have not misunderstood the rules, I followed the clarification by Gerri and then the credit would have read Vízner and then there should not be need of an common name...
I totally agree with you. We have the same problem that what we have with FRANCOIS that american people want to transform to Francois instead of François, which is an enormous spelling mistake. What would they say if we wrote Sennedy instead of Kennedy. They do not realise that it is exactly the same as ç and c are not the same letters, with very different pronunciation. Gerri made a clarification, Ken made another clarification that said just the contrary, that was one year ago, and Ken didn't modify that in the rules he updated far more recently. So, you are right, we must use the correct name. | | | | Images from movies |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Posts: 21,610 |
| | Posted: | | | | No you are dead WRONG, surfeur. We follow the credits even Ken said so, if you recall. We follow what the credits not YOUR imagination. Do you get it yet. If we followed what you want we WOULD have a total mess, far bigger than what we have right now. Stop it and keep you stuff to yourself. Ken overruled what Gerri had said and we follow the credits for Credited As, you do have the CommonName if you can document your FRANCOIS and I won't argue with you there with documentation, but stop trying to use yout imagined and non-existent data. Skip  | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here
Billy Video | | | | Last edited: by Forum Moderator |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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