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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Visual Effects Supervisor Dr. Ken Jones |
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| T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | There's currently a contribution up that proposes to change a visual effects supervisor credit for "Dr. Ken Jones" into "Ken Jones [Dr. Ken Jones]", citing the updated rules on honorifics. I understand that, but now I'm wondering: isn't this some kind of a stage name? Mr. Jones isn't a real "Dr." - it seems to be kind of a nickname, but "Dr. Ken Jones" is the most-credited form of his name.
So how do we treat this? Does the honorifics rule also apply when it's used as a nickname? Or do we see this one as a stage name, and put it all in the first name field?
Personally, I'm not to keen on using "Ken Jones", since I've already got a British production designer named Ken Jones in my database, and for neither a birth year can be found, meaning I'll have no contributable way to distinguish between them. |
| | Corne | Registered: Nov. 1, 2000 |
Registered: April 5, 2007 | Posts: 1,059 |
| Posted: | | | | The honorifics rule doesn't apply for stage names. According to wikipedia there are two distinct honorofics in modern English: Quote: 1. Honorifics which can be used of any adult of the appropriate sex include "Mr", "Mrs", "Miss", and "Ms". 2. Honorifics that denote the honored person's occupation, for instance "Doctor", "Coach", Officer, "Father" (for a priest), or "Professor". Including abbreviations of academic degrees.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honorific#Modern_English_honorificsHonorific titles used for nicknames or stage names doesn't apply as an official honorific but is part of the stage name. 'Dr.' isn't the honorific for the occupation of visual effects. Only when Ken Jones is a doctor (has a academic degree for doctor) the honorific rule applies. | | | Cor | | | Last edited: by Corne |
| | T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Corne: Quote: Only when Ken Jones is a doctor (has a academic degree for doctor) the honorific rule applies. I don't believe he has. As always, though, that's hard to prove - who am I to say where that nickname comes from? So assuming that this visual effects supervisor indeed has no real academic degree, then we treat "Dr. Ken Jones" as a stage name? |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote: There's currently a contribution up that proposes to change a visual effects supervisor credit for "Dr. Ken Jones" into "Ken Jones [Dr. Ken Jones]", citing the updated rules on honorifics. I understand that, but now I'm wondering: isn't this some kind of a stage name? Mr. Jones isn't a real "Dr." - it seems to be kind of a nickname, but "Dr. Ken Jones" is the most-credited form of his name.
So how do we treat this? Does the honorifics rule also apply when it's used as a nickname? Or do we see this one as a stage name, and put it all in the first name field?
Personally, I'm not to keen on using "Ken Jones", since I've already got a British production designer named Ken Jones in my database, and for neither a birth year can be found, meaning I'll have no contributable way to distinguish between them. Do you have a basis or some sort of documentation to back up your comment, Tim. Based on the data I don't see anything there that indicates a stage name or a nickname. I believe that you are simply making an unsubstantiated assumption. Based on the data I see no issue with the Contribution you are describing. I understand your concern relative to the CLT and the BY, but it was not me that lobbied for the current change in the Rules. You have discovered the problem caused by it and the price that will be paid. But no one wants to listen when Skip something is a bad idea, and i did and it was and now we KNOW. Too bad, perhaps Ken will change the Rule back to what it was originally, the work to this point would be minimal as I haven't seen a mad scramble to make wholesale changes. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | I see you claimimng nickname and stage name I don't see you presenting any documentation to back it up. Sorry, tim, you have to do a lot better than that. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Rev. Jesse Jackson and Rev. Al Sharpton, neither one has ever attended and graduated any sort of divinity and or legally pastors, but I would wager you would have a very difficult time claiming that they were stage names or nicknames, even though they are. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: May 20, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,934 |
| Posted: | | | | He actually has a PhD Here is the referenceSo yes, he is a real Dr. Charlie |
| Registered: May 20, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,934 |
| Posted: | | | | Jesse Jackson has 2 degrees in Theology, for only attending 1 year of Seminary one Honorary Doctorate on base upon education and Life experience (if only we could all get degrees like that), but he is an ordained minister.
Charlie | | | Last edited: by CharlieM |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Good work, Charlie, i was just preparing to check next on the list after his website. And thank you for that, Charlie, I knew everything, I hadn't heard that he was actually ordained by anyone. An honorary degree does not a Rev make. But if he has been ordained that's a different story. Sorry, Tim. Your assumption was wrong. And unfortunately his website revealed nothing about a BY, I am still looking trying to find a BY on either one. The Dr. seems to be a dead end, unless you want to contact him through his website. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| Registered: May 20, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,934 |
| Posted: | | | | His Website here has some very nice pictures. Apparently, he was using digital back in the 70's when working at JPL for the viking lander project. Charlie |
| Registered: January 1, 2009 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,087 |
| Posted: | | | | SO if he is really a Dr. it would be correct to change into "Ken Jones [Dr. Ken Jones]"?* And now we have the problem finding a BY for distinguishing?
*If Ken Jones is his real name. | | | Last edited: by VirusPil |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Yes indeedy and his BY would appear to be circa 1945-1950, but that's just a guess. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting VirusPil: Quote: SO if he is really a Dr. it would be correct to change into "Ken Jones [Dr. Ken Jones]"?* And now we have the problem finding a BY for distinguishing?
If Ken Jones is his real name. Like I said, Virus, I said this was a bad idea when it was being hahsed over, Ken made the change and now, we have a problem. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video | | | Last edited: by Winston Smith |
| Registered: January 1, 2009 | Reputation: | Posts: 3,087 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Prof. Kingsfield: Quote: Quoting VirusPil:
Quote: SO if he is really a Dr. it would be correct to change into "Ken Jones [Dr. Ken Jones]"?* And now we have the problem finding a BY for distinguishing?
If Ken Jones is his real name. Like I said, Virus, I said this was a bad idea when it was being hahsed over, Ken made the change and now, we have a problem. And I think you were not the only one. |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 21,610 |
| Posted: | | | | I can get you the address and phone number for Ken Jones-Production Designer, he apparently is in Colorado. I even read his resume, which he has posted at IMDb, but that was not revealing relative to his BY. IF that is him on the home page of his website, he is a good 15-20 years younger than the Dr. Ken jones but that again is simply a guess.At the moment I think we are at an impasse, but there is ceratinly enough out there, that would enable to you to perhaps contact one of both of these gentlemen, Tim, and maybe they will provide you with a BY. | | | ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!! CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it. Outta here
Billy Video |
| | T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting CharlieM: Quote: He actually has a PhD
Here is the reference
So yes, he is a real Dr.
Charlie Excellent - many thanks! Quoting VirusPil: Quote: And now we have the problem finding a BY for distinguishing? Unfortunately, yes, and we won't be able to find it. More fake birth years - and that when we had a perfectly valid common name in "Dr. Ken Jones" which properly distinguished him from any other Ken Jones's in the db... | | | Last edited: by T!M |
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